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Cass Ole


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#61 Roulett

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Posted 08 October 2006 - 10:16 PM

QUOTE(maigray @ Oct 1 2006, 03:49 PM) View Post

I

The official website has some explanations for why they picked it and what a rigorous shoot it was.

(Arabian-Horse-World, April 1978)
Film production divided into two distinct halves as locations were settled. Sardinia was chosen for the island sequences of the film because of the spectacular remote areas of its coast; and Toronto, Canada, was selected as a perfect match for the eastern seaboard of the United States in the late 40's.

[filming was completed over a nine-week period, and despite the obstacles presented by the difficult terrain, director Carroll Ballard feels the varied and unusual beauty of Sardinia captured on film creates a spectacular backdrop for the movie.


M


The side of Sardinia that was used for the beach scene's is called the Costa Smeralda because the water is emerald green .... so clear you can see all the way to the bottom, it's simply beautiful. The sand is spotless with little flowers popping up thru the sand. NO vehicles are permitted on those beaches and they are anal about trash. Cows and sheep have the right of way ... no kidding, cows just wonder around free in that part of the island. Sardinia is about an hour's flight from Rome. The homes that are high on the hills overlook the beaches b/c of the strict ruling about keeping the beaches natural and away from the construction.

I watched them shot seven days of the beach scenes ... I didn't see other horses or stand-ins ... not sure where they had them but the only horse I saw and met was Cass Ole .... like I said in my other post, the biggest problem was the lighting and sun reflecting off the water........ making Cass Ole's coat color a problem. I didn't get a chance to see the movie until years later ....... I had pictures of all this but God only knows where the hell they are now. I mean who knew I would one day own an Arabian and want those pic's for reference. :-(


Angelique
Proud owner of Russian Roulett+
http://russianroulett.net/Tribute.html
2003/2004 USEF HOTY, Reg. 2 H/J
2005 Special Recognition/Ambassador Award as a JUMPER!
2006 - Senior Masters winner
2007 - 18 Division Championships --- 2 reserves --- besting over 1200 jumpers
2008 - retires as #65 in the Centennial 100 list

#62 maigray

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Posted 09 October 2006 - 05:13 AM

QUOTE
Yeah, he was 'just a "stand in" ' and not worth a mention or getting his name right.


I did apologize for mis-spelling his name. I spelled it correctly in that same post as well. This was a nice discussion, but it is obvious you are quite upset about it. Please back off on taking it out on me.

M
I know great horses live again
~ Stanley Harrison

#63 Jane

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Posted 09 October 2006 - 10:04 AM

Were the other horses all paid for their parts? Did they know from the beginning they would be the "doubles" and Cass Ole would be the main promoted star?

#64 MommaToABelle

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Posted 09 October 2006 - 10:30 AM

Wow.

I wonder if Hollywood Stunt Doubles feel the same? Or body doubles? Somehow I doubt it.

I feel you have great passion for Diamond Night, and rightfully so, however using fire and bitterness to get your point across is not the right tact to inform or educate anyone.

Just a thought.

I thoroughly enjoyed the Black Stallion movies, regardless of which horse was doing what.


Long Live the Black Stallion!


Robin in MI
Belle Afire GA leased to MN

#65 maigray

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Posted 09 October 2006 - 12:08 PM

QUOTE
You are all happy to review everything about HIM, but if you even MENTION the other horses, it is with misinformation and to denegrate their work and relegate it to insignifince.


Please pick one instance where this was done by someone on this thread!

I myself brought up Fae-Jur's involvement, and made sure to correctly name the other stunt horses in the first film. Alix brought up Diamond Night's involvement and I posted a follow-up as to what happened to him.

The fact that any other horses in the movie are being mentioned in passing probably has to do with the fact that this thread is entitled "Cass Ole."

Most of the reminiscences and talk have also centered around the first film - in which Diamond Night and El Mohktar were not involved.

Now that we've all been accused of "denigrating" the other horses, as well as being essentially clueless dupes in this apparent marketing charade engineered by IAHA, the whole thread has been soured and will be dropped by everyone who was enjoying talking about the horse and his accomplishments.

M
I know great horses live again
~ Stanley Harrison

#66 Kit Khat

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Posted 09 October 2006 - 12:25 PM

Fine. Call the "other horses"

STAND ins

When they did the work

And CASS "stood around looking pretty"

And say, you did not "denegrate" their efforts.

I shall remove my previous posts an you can all go back to admiring Cass Ole' and pretend he did it all by himself.

If you pm me your snail mail address, I will send you free of charge a video tape, with scenes from each film, and footage of each horse in training, showing how it was done. This was made by Diamond Night's owner as BREED PROMOTION.

Each horse is shown, their proper name and owners identified, and their accomplishments enumerated. Including Cass Ole's entire show record. Giving full and honest and even handed coverage to every horse, and done to promote Arabians as beautiful, trainable, safe for children etc.

Then you might get why some think they are unfairly treated.

Going back now to remove offensive posts asking for fair treatment, clearly not deserved of course.

#67 JSPDesign

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Posted 09 October 2006 - 12:37 PM

I reread the whole darn thread because for the most part it WAS informative and interesting. The original question was regarding his pedigree, accomplishments (show wise) and prodigeny. No where did I see an intentional insult towards any other horse involved in the movies. I repeat, no intentional insult. I guess I just haven't met the horse yet that cares to steal all the glory from other horses and begs to have magazine articles written about him. Most horses usually desire more fundamental things like great grazing, fresh water and a little warm sunshine. ;) Tongue in cheek of course!
Jamie


#68 Kit Khat

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Posted 09 October 2006 - 12:41 PM

Anyone who has been in this discussion, who pm's me a snail mail address can have a free video of training the horses for the film, both films, all horses evenly represented.

[If you don't supply an address, I can't send it, obviously.]

Fair as I can be.

Of course THE HORSE had nothing to do with unfairness. And I have never been unfair to Cass. Unlike OTHERS, I give credit where it is due.

You wanna see how they did a lot of the stuff you enjoyed in the films, I can show you. Be happy to. And to show you what "even handed" means when you talk about the horses in the movies you enjoyed.

#69 maigray

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Posted 09 October 2006 - 01:02 PM

QUOTE
Fine. Call the "other horses"

STAND ins

When they did the work

And CASS "stood around looking pretty"

And say, you did not "denegrate" their efforts.


In fact, my exact words were "who knows how many other stand-ins were used" in which I meant to refer to any other horses we might not know about - not the ones we do know about.

I guess my major point in taking up this issue is that your posts come across as denigration as well. It's rather like a self-fulfilling prophecy. You denigrate our postings and Cass Ole in your own posts, yet complain about how we are denigrating the other horses. You are obviously incensed at the ignorance displayed about Diamond Night's accomplishments, yet you will remove your posts about him, and people thus continue on without learning more about him.

For the record, I honestly do not understand how the term a "stand-in" could possibly be construed as denigration. If we're not talking about the ALL horses in the film, it's because the thread is entitled "Cass Ole." If I'm taking up this issue with you, it's because I'm a little miffed at seeing a nice thread turn bad, being accused of "unfair treatment" and "denigration" of a horse's accomplishments because of a typo, and having everyone's posts dismissed as "fiction."

Is that fair?

M
I know great horses live again
~ Stanley Harrison

#70 Kit Khat

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Posted 09 October 2006 - 01:18 PM

Let us take a series of scenes in the "Returns" film as an example, and examine Cass Ole's work vs his "stand ins" or "the extras" {whose names need not be given, or properly given}.

The 'princess' can't ride The Black; she's shown being bucked off him repeatedly in a training session.

[Horse is Diamond Night.]

She requests Alex go out with her to work with him in the night; he agrees, and again, she is bucked off.

[Horse is Diamond Night. When the horse is shown standing afterwards, that's Cass Ole'. Essentially, if the horse is standing and the actors are talking {Horse as background, looking stately and very pretty}, its Cass Ole'; if there is action, such as bucking when cued, its Diamond Night.]

The Bad Guys come on a raid, and Alex gets up on The Black to run; both are captured.

[Horse is Diamond Night.]

The Black is rearing and fighting the Bad Guys in a ruined castle/compound.

[Scene is possibly a composit of Diamond Night and Cass Ole', but mainly, it is Diamond Night.]

The Black is shut in a pen, and rears and paws the door to get out. {One of the most difficult to teach stunts of the entire film, as this is not a natural horse behavior.}

[Horse is Diamond Night.]

Horse breaks free and runs up to Alex.

[Horse is Diamond Night.]

Alex vaults onto The Black.

[Standing horse onto whom Alex valuts is Cass Ole'.]

The Black runs through the ruined castle, Alex bareback, much broken-field running in steep, rocky, rather dangerous narrow tracks.

[Horse is Diamond Night.]

But we talk about Cass Ole' as "The Black Stallion star" and Diamond Night as "a stand in".

If you were involved with one horse, not the other, and yours was the one who was ignored or, if mentioned, nearly always was given the wrong name and was called "an extra" or "stand in",

Might you come to resent it?

Guess not.

I noted the thread was started about Cass Ole' and not the others. I could have commented from the start, that Cass Ole' was NOT "The" Black Stallion horse, but one of several. I did not. I only commented when Diamond Night was mentioned by name ....... spelled wrong, as it almost ALWAYS is.

Typo, fine. I make my share. But the misstatements about all the horses EXCEPT Cass Ole' are far more common than actual honest factual information in print. Deliberately so.

When Horse & Rider used Diamond Night on their cover and a major article about the film work inside, they absolutely REFUSED to correct their mis-naming the horse. Ditto the Saddlebred article, where the used 3 wrong names and implied he was an American Saddlebred. And so on.

Never saw such falsehoods about Cass Ole', and his background was always accurately given. Interesting contrast. But I do NOT denegrate Cass. Only say, "He didn't do it alone."

Again my offer of the video stands.

#71 CarrieLewis

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Posted 09 October 2006 - 02:40 PM

Cass Ole+'s offspring with breeder notation, as listed by Datasource:

133 records found. Page 1 of 1.

Name Number Foaled Gender Color Breeder
TSU-KIBA AHR*93808 27 Feb 1973 Mare Chestnut DONALD D OR ALLEEN C ANDERSON
FIESTA OLE AHR*125728 07 Feb 1975 Mare Bay DR LEO CUELLO
AL ZIRR AHR*117307 27 Feb 1975 Stallion Black DONALD E WORCESTER
DR CASS AHR*126058 12 Mar 1975 Gelding Black DR LEO CUELLO
DR OLE AHR*125727 17 Mar 1975 Gelding Bay DR LEO CUELLO
DR CASS OLE AHR*130118 19 Apr 1975 Stallion Bay DONALD E LESTER JR
CASEEMA HAHR*1A153389 17 Jun 1975 Mare Black
DR SHIVAGO AHR*127892 25 Jul 1975 Gelding Chestnut DR LEO CUELLO
MISS FRANNY AHR*135307 16 Jan 1976 Mare Bay DONALD E LESTER JR
STAR OF OLE AHR*139184 04 Feb 1976 Mare Bay DR LEO CUELLO
ALEGRE OLE AHR*133671 12 Mar 1976 Mare Chestnut DR LEO CUELLO
EL CASS OLE AHR*133566 14 Apr 1976 Stallion Bay DR LEO CUELLO
DONNA CASSERRA AHR*151912 27 Jun 1976 Mare Bay DR LEO CUELLO
CAFE OLE AHR*139182 22 Jul 1976 Gelding Bay DR LEO CUELLO
OLES ALI KHAN AHR*143120 14 Aug 1976 Stallion Chestnut DR LEO CUELLO
OLES CARA SUCIA AHR*150035 10 Jan 1977 Mare Chestnut DR LEO CUELLO
TI BARS OLE HAHR*1A174445 29 Jan 1977 Gelding Bay
SON OF BLACK AHR*150081 08 Feb 1977 Gelding Black DR LEO CUELLO
VIVA OLE AHR*149176 14 Mar 1977 Mare Bay DR LEO CUELLO
EBONY OLE HAHR*2A172120 29 Mar 1977 Gelding Black FROMAN H COWAN II OR PHYLLIS G COWAN
BINT CASS OLE AHR*150415 22 Apr 1977 Mare Black DR LEO CUELLO
OLE HOMBRE AHR*164383 04 May 1977 Gelding Chestnut MICHAEL G COOK
OLES AMOR AHR*163311 29 Sep 1977 Mare Grey DR LEO CUELLO
CZARR OF OLE AHR*167113 05 Jan 1978 Gelding Grey DR LEO CUELLO
CASSOLETTE AHR*180033 08 Mar 1978 Mare Bay GARY D OR KAREN L MINYEN
BOLEJO AHR*186507 02 Mar 1979 Stallion Grey RALPH TRIMBLE
SUZARRITTA AHR*184586 07 Mar 1979 Mare Bay DR LEO CUELLO
CASSA STARR AHR*183534 09 Mar 1979 Stallion Grey DON AND MARILYN BURT
BANDOLE AHR*197564 09 Mar 1979 Gelding Bay ELLIS D AND SHARON E NUNN
SENECAS OLE HAHR*1A199341 29 Mar 1979 Mare Brown
WN OLE AHR*185857 04 Apr 1979 Gelding Grey DR LEO CUELLO
CASSOLETTA AHR*197562 20 Apr 1979 Mare Chestnut MAJOR AND MRS ALVA F LETT JR
REY OLE+/ AHR*198061 27 Apr 1979 Gelding Black BENJAMIN K AND FLORENCE M FIKE
BENRAZ OLE AAHR*AA4747 14 Aug 1979 Gelding Bay JACK NAVIAUX
NOCHE OLE HAHR*1A205915 04 Apr 1980 Gelding Black PATRICIA WALKER JACOBS
BLACK SAND AHR*209502 06 Jun 1980 Stallion Black BENJAMIN K AND FLORENCE M FIKE
CASS OLITA AHR*223422 18 Feb 1981 Mare Bay WILLIAM A DIAS OR ANN STANTON DIAS
COKETA-OLE AHR*228257 18 Feb 1981 Mare Bay DR LEO CUELLO
OIL OF OLE AHR*222537 05 Mar 1981 Gelding Chestnut TRIPPLE M FARMS
CASS OLES CHICO HAHR*1A213331 15 Mar 1981 Gelding Black
LA MANCHAS MINX AHR*224482 22 Mar 1981 Mare Black WILLIAM A DIAS OR ANN STANTON DIAS
OLES CARMEL BAY AHR*225586 04 Apr 1981 Gelding Bay BUXTON ASSOCIATES INC
OLE-OLE AHR*224053 08 Apr 1981 Mare Grey MARJORY F TONE
SHAHBUS BAR OLE HAHR*1A213404 18 Apr 1981 Mare Black
WHY NOT ME HAHR*1A215214 27 Apr 1981 Mare Bay
CASS ELAN AHR*226579 10 May 1981 Gelding Chestnut J R BOWMAN
OLES BLACK MINX AHR*232535 20 May 1981 Mare Black J R BOWMAN
OLES SUNRISE AHR*233805 10 Jun 1981 Mare Bay LANA SUE FINCKE-MAYES
OLES BEAU AHR*236872 11 Jun 1981 Stallion Bay DR LEO CUELLO
CASSMIRA AHR*236873 11 Jun 1981 Mare Grey J R BOWMAN
CASSANDRA OLE AHR*325464 24 Jun 1981 Mare Grey DR LEO CUELLO
OLES ANTONIA AHR*236868 16 Jul 1981 Mare Bay DONALD E WORCESTER
IBN CASS OLE AHR*241829 20 Jan 1982 Gelding Bay DR LEO CUELLO
VIVA CASS OLE+/ AHR*243520 29 Jan 1982 Gelding Bay DEWEY E FLOYD
CLASS OLE AHR*241948 31 Jan 1982 Gelding Bay DR STAFFAN K WESTBERG AND TAMARA M WESTBERG LA FOE MD
MAMSELLE BASKOLE AHR*242247 31 Jan 1982 Mare Black WILLIAM A DIAS OR ANN STANTON DIAS
BELLO OLE AHR*244391 02 Feb 1982 Stallion Bay BUXTON ASSOCIATES INC
MARIPOSA OLE AHR*263290 02 Mar 1982 Mare Bay DR LEONARDO LINCE
OLES FLAME AHR*246555 14 Mar 1982 Stallion Chestnut TRIPPLE M FARMS
MA CASSANDRA AHR*256460 14 Mar 1982 Mare Chestnut ARTHUR L AND JOY B SNELL
CASS OLES CRYSTAL AHR*245690 26 Mar 1982 Mare Grey TOMMY OR DOROTHY BROWN
CASANDRA OLE AHR*303546 03 Apr 1982 Mare Grey WERNER N KEIDEL
SUSANA OLE AHR*245553 18 Apr 1982 Mare Bay DR LEO CUELLO
LA MANCHAS SHETAN AHR*271873 08 Apr 1983 Stallion Black WILLIAM A DIAS OR ANN STANTON DIAS
ROSS OLE AHR*270479 25 Apr 1983 Gelding Bay DR LEO CUELLO
MISIK ILWAN AHR*270627 25 Apr 1983 Mare Black FRANKE FEAGINS
IBN CASS AHR*276293 18 Jun 1983 Stallion Black DR LEO CUELLO
CARCEL DE AMOR AHR*287803 16 Aug 1983 Mare Bay DR LEO CUELLO
NED OLE AHR*343252 07 Jan 1984 Stallion Chestnut ALBERT DENNE
BASEMATHS AHR*340839 16 Jan 1984 Mare Black DR LEO CUELLO
TAPHATH AHR*302155 25 Jan 1984 Mare Bay DR LEO CUELLO
ALEXIS OLE AHR*291737 31 Jan 1984 Mare Black DR LEO CUELLO
SUNRIZE DANZER AHR*288297 02 Feb 1984 Stallion Bay BARBARA MC GOWAN MC MURREY
CASA OLE AHR*295464 21 Feb 1984 Gelding Grey JOHN AND CONNIE TAYLOR
WMB LASS OLE AHR*298267 14 Apr 1984 Mare Black EDWARD A BENKE
TAPESTRY OLE AHR*354962 19 Apr 1984 Mare Grey DONNA GATTSHALL
NOIR SHETAN AHR*320565 01 Jan 1985 Stallion Black DR LEO CUELLO
SAA CZORRO AHR*322803 27 Jan 1985 Stallion Black DR LEO CUELLO
SIR CHESTER AHR*327600 20 Mar 1985 Gelding Chestnut DR LEO CUELLO
LA CASSETTE AHR*347998 26 Apr 1985 Mare Black RICHARD AND GAIL GEORGE
MARIA OLE AHR*343722 30 Apr 1985 Mare Black BETTY BENKE
CASSIE OLE AHR*343107 10 May 1985 Mare Chestnut DOROTHY HAWN
SON OF CASS AHR*343702 10 May 1985 Gelding Black DR LEO CUELLO
OLE BEAUSAYE AHR*339735 10 Jun 1985 Stallion Bay HENRY E HOOD OR BONNIE SMITH HOOD
JET OLE AHR*354701 28 Jun 1985 Gelding Black DR LEO CUELLO
SHETAN OLE AHR*356616 30 Jan 1986 Gelding Black DR LEO CUELLO
OLES FAN AHR*363357 08 Feb 1986 Stallion Black WINDMILL BLACK ARABIANS
OLES CZORIDA AHR*359199 15 Feb 1986 Mare Black DR LEO CUELLO
RAHADA CASSZHARA AHR*364247 11 Mar 1986 Mare Grey RUBEN GARCIA
MARIE OLE AHR*363462 23 May 1986 Mare Black BETTY BENKE
EL OLE AHR*363375 03 Jun 1986 Gelding Black BETTY BENKE
CASS AMIE AHR*363608 13 Jul 1986 Stallion Black DR LEO CUELLO
CASS-O-FLASH AHR*365192 16 Jul 1986 Mare Chestnut BURT AND ONNIE ZEEFF
WMB CASS OLE AHR*367537 24 Aug 1986 Gelding Black WINDMILL BLACK ARABIANS
WMB FANAFAS GOLD AHR*381387 11 Jan 1987 Mare Chestnut WINDMILL BLACK ARABIANS
CZOROLE AHR*401378 05 Feb 1987 Mare Black DR LEO CUELLO
NOIR AMIGA OLE AHR*398593 08 Feb 1987 Mare Black DR LEO CUELLO
NOIRTINA OLE AHR*427765 15 Feb 1987 Stallion Black DR LEO CUELLO
DALULITA OLE AHR*418394 20 Feb 1987 Mare Black DR LEO CUELLO
SHIVAGUITO OLE AHR*398599 07 Mar 1987 Stallion Chestnut DR LEO CUELLO
OLES WISDOM AHR*398587 13 Apr 1987 Stallion Black DR LEO CUELLO
WMB ELS OLE AHR*393712 27 May 1987 Stallion Black BETTY BENKE
LA CASSOULET AHR*394687 03 Jun 1987 Gelding Black BETTY BENKE
SORAIDA AHR*424162 01 Aug 1987 Mare Chestnut DR LEO CUELLO
CASSAMIGA OLE AHR*411404 21 Jan 1988 Gelding Black DR LEO CUELLO
BUCEPHALUS J OLE AHR*411068 22 Jan 1988 Stallion Black DR LEO CUELLO
LOU DENITA OLE AHR*411047 25 Jan 1988 Mare Bay DR LEO CUELLO
BINT CZORIDA AHR*404997 08 Feb 1988 Mare Black DR LEO CUELLO
EL AKBAR AHR*404996 22 Feb 1988 Stallion Black DR LEO CUELLO
EL MUJTAR AHR*404995 01 Mar 1988 Stallion Black DR LEO CUELLO
LEGUISAMO H OLE AHR*411084 29 Apr 1988 Stallion Black DR LEO CUELLO
SA AMIGA OLE AHR*445491 01 Jan 1989 Mare Black DR LEO CUELLO
SA LOUDENITA OLE AHR*435112 15 Jan 1989 Mare Bay DR LEO CUELLO
SA VALENTINA OLE AHR*435085 19 Jan 1989 Mare Black DR LEO CUELLO
RSA CASTALA AHR*435044 03 Mar 1989 Mare Chestnut C JEVAN WILLIAMS
CASS AMIGO AHR*445488 10 Mar 1990 Stallion Black DR LEO CUELLO
PATRICK VAL OLE AHR*445494 17 Mar 1990 Stallion Black DR LEO CUELLO
SANTA ANITA OLE AHR*458714 10 May 1990 Mare Bay DR LEO CUELLO
OLES DREAM AHR*460532 22 May 1990 Mare Chestnut DR LEO CUELLO
SHITAM OLE AHR*454253 29 May 1990 Stallion Black DR LEO CUELLO
CASS LOVDENITA AHR*458713 29 May 1990 Mare Bay DR LEO CUELLO
SANTANA OLE AHR*476193 03 Feb 1991 Mare Grey DR LEO CUELLO
SA CASSAMIGA OLE AHR*488521 18 Feb 1991 Mare Black DR LEO CUELLO
CASVALENTINA OLE AHSB*29946 07 Mar 1991 Mare Bay DR LEO CUELLO
CASVALENTINA OLE AHR*476260 07 Mar 1991 Mare Bay DR LEO CUELLO
RSA CASSHEIK AHR*465924 19 Mar 1991 Stallion Black C JEVAN WILLIAMS
FFA SPATS OLE AHR*475075 06 May 1991 Stallion Black MARGO OR LAWRENCE SHALLCROSS
CASAL OLE AHR*476192 06 Jun 1991 Stallion Bay DR LEO CUELLO
C SINCERELY YOURS AHR*476909 21 Jun 1991 Mare Grey BARBARA BOWMAN
CASSETTE OLE AHR*485546 15 Feb 1992 Mare Bay KAREN C YOUNG
MOJO OLE AHR*485722 25 Feb 1992 Gelding Chestnut CHUCK YOUNG
OMEGA CASS OLE AHR*498090 07 Jun 1993 Stallion Black DR LEO CUELLO
SA OMEGA CASSOLE AHR*498146 26 Jun 1993 Stallion Bay DR LEO CUELLO

Best regards
Carrie Lewis
AFAHA/TFAHA
Happy trails,
Carrie A. Woolverton
Triple Cross Ranches & Honey Creek Farms
http://www.honeycreekfarms.biz/

American Foundation Arabian Horses - The Original ATVs

Pulque Preservation Program
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When age prevents me from riding,
I will still keep horses as long as
I can shuffle along with a pail.
When I can no longer shuffle,
I will roll my wheelchair to the pasture
Fence to watch my horses graze.




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